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Post by nomar33 on Nov 26, 2009 14:07:24 GMT -5
Marist already retired too many numbers. Smits and Fitz are the only two that should be retired. They both led their teams to multiple NCAA tournament appearances which, sad to say, is a monumental achievement on the men's side. Fitzies resume stands alone, including no worse than a 3-3 record in the NCAA tournament.
I disagree OldFox - even though the NCAA's win's and losses can't always be the criteria - i.e the original Manning never would be in HOF if wins came into play.
Know nothing about Smith - but for a time was Marist's all time leading scorer - that says somethng
Davis - was the assist God until Jordan - and played an important part in the movie "The Super".
Jordan - easliy the second best player ever to come out of Marist - drafted 2nd round. And got Marist its only post season win.
Fitz=Smits but like Smits, fitz was not alone one could say Viani = Davis.
Does playing a full 4 years come into play when deciding?
For me got no problem with following
Smith, Davis, Smits, and Jordan
Fitz, Kresge, and Viani
would be proud to have any of those retired.
PS - there better be a bronze statue of Giorgis in the works!!!!!!!!
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Post by oldfox on Nov 26, 2009 15:25:19 GMT -5
Marist already retired too many numbers. Smits and Fitz are the only two that should be retired. They both led their teams to multiple NCAA tournament appearances which, sad to say, is a monumental achievement on the men's side. Fitzies resume stands alone, including no worse than a 3-3 record in the NCAA tournament. I disagree OldFox - even though the NCAA's win's and losses can't always be the criteria - i.e the original Manning never would be in HOF if wins came into play. Know nothing about Smith - but for a time was Marist's all time leading scorer - that says somethng Davis - was the assist God until Jordan - and played an important part in the movie "The Super". Jordan - easliy the second best player ever to come out of Marist - drafted 2nd round. And got Marist its only post season win. Fitz=Smits but like Smits, fitz was not alone one could say Viani = Davis. Does playing a full 4 years come into play when deciding? For me got no problem with following Smith, Davis, Smits, and Jordan Fitz, Kresge, and Viani would be proud to have any of those retired. PS - there better be a bronze statue of Giorgis in the works!!!!!!!! Davis did a Pizza Hut commercial too. I still wouldn't retire his number. ;D To me its about the player being universally acknowledged (Marist basketball community and fans) as having taken the program to another level. Smits and Fitz made their side of the basketball program at Marist relevant beyond the ECAC Metro and the MAAC. You can probably argue that Fitz took them 2 leaps with the NCAA wins. Marist MBB hasn't sniffed the NCAA's since Rik's era and if anyone doubts what Fitz has meant to the WBB program, well, wait until next year. JJ is a tough one for me. He did get the only postseason win. I would be more inclined to agree on JJ if they had gotten to the NCAA Tournament and won a game. I don't disagree that Smith, Davis, Jordan, Viani, Kresge were all-time Marist players and achieved greatnes in their careers. I just think the player has to be at the heart of taking the program the next level to have that number retired. I think they raised the bar for everyone who comes after. |
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Post by nomar33 on Nov 27, 2009 8:47:50 GMT -5
I don't think it is about taking a program to another level. This is an individual achievement granted surrounding yourself with others who help you attain that doesnt hurt.
If it was about taking the program to another level then who can we retire after Fitz - taking the women's program to another level now - well that would be hard.
I think if the player is considered one of the best players ever to come through a program (also must have great character) then that person should have thier number retired. I'm not talking about averaging 26 pts for one year - im talking a career.
And I think all of those players mentioned did that.
Do I think Davis gets there without Smits no - but I'm sure Parish and McHale are thanking Bird for their HOF plaques.
The people we are talking about come along every 15 years or so - now Giorgis might end up having the rafters look like the Celtics if he keeps recruiting they way he can.
My opinion is that taking the team to the NCAA's isnt what retiring the number should be - it is thanking the athlets that just went above and beyond what others have done at Marist.
Personally I can't understand why Marist hasn't retired the number 11 in Soccer - damn my career stats where games started 8 goals 2 assts 5 - i mean really
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Post by oldfox on Nov 27, 2009 9:46:54 GMT -5
I don't think it is about taking a program to another level. This is an individual achievement granted surrounding yourself with others who help you attain that doesnt hurt. If it was about taking the program to another level then who can we retire after Fitz - taking the women's program to another level now - well that would be hard. I think if the player is considered one of the best players ever to come through a program (also must have great character) then that person should have thier number retired. I'm not talking about averaging 26 pts for one year - im talking a career. And I think all of those players mentioned did that. Do I think Davis gets there without Smits no - but I'm sure Parish and McHale are thanking Bird for their HOF plaques. The people we are talking about come along every 15 years or so - now Giorgis might end up having the rafters look like the Celtics if he keeps recruiting they way he can. My opinion is that taking the team to the NCAA's isnt what retiring the number should be - it is thanking the athlets that just went above and beyond what others have done at Marist. Personally I can't understand why Marist hasn't retired the number 11 in Soccer - damn my career stats where games started 8 goals 2 assts 5 - i mean really Regarding your Soccer career - I hear the Murrays are waiting for the price of bronze to comedown so they can do both statues at the same time. ;D I'd be OK with never retiring another number on either side. To me it has to be stats, leadership, and being the catalyst for a significant event in advancing the program. I don't see it as a HOF issue either. You can put as many people who did something special in their careers in the Marist HOF. To retire a number, I think you need to a very, very special member of that group. I wouldn't put Kresge in as a player alone, but, for instance, if she adds a stellar coaching career to her resume at Marist -someone is gonna take over after BG- then I think you retire the number. What do other folks think about this? |
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Post by yankee on Nov 27, 2009 9:58:57 GMT -5
I am starting to lean with Old foxes thinking in terms of retiring numbers. Maybe only Fitz, as she has been the "man"  . However, something HAS to be done to recognize the team as a whole that got Marist those NCAA wins. Dahlman, Kresge, Viani, Smrdel, etc, have to be recognized somehow. Maybe Marist can do a whole team reunion and blow up the team photo and have each player sign it, then bronze it. Create a remember the great teams banner that each player signs and it stays in McCann for the rest of eternity:). Something. |
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Post by oldfox on Nov 27, 2009 12:53:52 GMT -5
I am starting to lean with Old foxes thinking in terms of retiring numbers. Maybe only Fitz, as she has been the "man" . However, something HAS to be done to recognize the team as a whole that got Marist those NCAA wins. Dahlman, Kresge, Viani, Smrdel, etc, have to be recognized somehow. Maybe Marist can do a whole team reunion and blow up the team photo and have each player sign it, then bronze it. Create a remember the great teams banner that each player signs and it stays in McCann for the rest of eternity:). Something. Great point about the team deserving recognition. What about putting the Sweet 16 team into the HOF as a unit? Their collective efforts culminated in a watershed event in the history of the program. I mean everybody. Players, coaches, managers, trainers, etc. |
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. However, something HAS to be done to recognize the team as a whole that got Marist those NCAA wins. Dahlman, Kresge, Viani, Smrdel, etc, have to be recognized somehow. Maybe Marist can do a whole team reunion and blow up the team photo and have each player sign it, then bronze it. Create a remember the great teams banner that each player signs and it stays in McCann for the rest of eternity:). Something.